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  1. #1
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    Hello everyone, I only need one..

    My name is Steve I have been trading only for 2 years now and always open to learn new trading ideas.
    This is a wonderful site I just joined and have not had time to take a good long look but will for sure.
    Thanks for having me
    .
    I have a question from my glance at the site it seems like you have every forex trading system known to man lol. My question is this with all the many systems we have here , is there at least one system that consistency brings in profit when followed exactly by the rules. My own experience has shown no such system exists or I have not come across it. They say well it works for some people and not for others. I'm not sure that is a correct statement. I would say yes it works for some people some of the time. If there is one person that uses a system that works over 60% all of the time that is all anyone needs. You can be a millionaire if you have something that works only 60% if you have good MM.

    I ask these questions because I recently lost a lot of money playing this game and I may be jaded but I am coming to the conclusion that no one is successful in Forex when you look at it long term. I would love to be proven wrong but so far my assessment of Forex trading is it's nothing else buy very educated gambling. I have yet to find one trader that trades Forex full time and is always in the black for years not weeks or months.

    thanks again sorry for the long post..

    Steve_xxtrader

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve_xxtrader View Post
    My name is Steve I have been trading only for 2 years now and always open to learn new trading ideas.
    This is a wonderful site I just joined and have not had time to take a good long look but will for sure.
    Thanks for having me
    .
    I have a question from my glance at the site it seems like you have every forex trading system known to man lol. My question is this with all the many systems we have here , #1) is there at least one system that consistency brings in profit when followed exactly by the rules. My own experience has shown no such system exists or I have not come across it. They say well it works for some people and not for others. I'm not sure that is a correct statement. I would say yes it works for some people some of the time. If there is one person that uses a system that works over 60% all of the time that is all anyone needs. You can be a millionaire #2) if you have something that works only 60% if you have good MM.

    I ask these questions because I recently lost a lot of money playing this game and I may be jaded but I am coming to the conclusion that #3) no one is successful in Forex when you look at it long term. I would love to be proven wrong but so far my assessment of Forex trading is it's nothing else buy #4) very educated gambling. I have yet to find one trader that trades Forex full time and is always in the black for years not weeks or months.

    thanks again sorry for the long post..

    Steve_xxtrader
    Hello Steve,

    Welcome to this lovely forum. You would surely receive many important & helpful insights on your query from many of the members here who knows this business inside out. But let me try to address this with my very limited knowledge and understanding. Here we go:

    First of all, your answer is hidden in your question itself.

    #1) Yes, there is. Which one?


    Visit: holy-grail-forex.com and you could buy this for only US$ 97.

    Jokes apart,

    To be serious, yes, it's there. Leave alone hit accuracy of 60%. I'm really comfortable with a hit accuracy of 40 - 50%.

    There are not one but MANY trading systems that consistently brings in profit when followed exactly by the rules.

    The problem is with the last part of the sentence - "...
    when followed exactly by the rules."

    Remember, we're human beings and not machines which perform repeatedly the exact same protocols 1000 times over & over again - precisely in accordance with the pre-defined set of Rules. We violate the 'exact rules' on drop of a hat that we're supposed to follow & then we blame it on the trading system, broker, big dogs, cyborgs, moons, stars and what not.

    Only the ONE single individual among a million who has the discipline to follow the exact set of instructions in strict accordance repeatedly and the understanding that two consecutive events are entirely independent are the one who closes the first year and the next 50 - 70 years of his/her life in Green.

    Trading and the market is located between the trader's two ears - it's all mental aspect.

    #2) Same as #1) above.

    Do you have it what it takes to follow a trading system with very few and very very simple set of rules?

    Leave alone millionaire - there is no upper limit to the income generated. But read #1) and the line above.


    #3) Are you sure? Think again my dear friend.

    Just because some fishes lives in ponds near my house, am I correct to assume that all fishes in this world lives in ponds?


    #4) Ummm, it's Worse. Least in gambling houses they provide you with couple of drinks and many hot chicks around. But here, brokers offer nothing but a cold phone call.

    It's gambling when you don't know what you're doing. And this attitude is what it makes it frustrating.





    ** A simple proposal 4 you:

    You might want to take this up for assessing yourself and this activity is not for others. This activity would potentially answer your question:

    "My own experience has shown no such system exists or I have not come across it."


    Search in Google using these keywords:

    Trendline Break+jhig

    What is the first result?


    Could you take up demo trades based on this system for next 4 months, execute the trades as you would have done on a real money account plus post your trades on this very thread regularly for the entire period?

    Suggeted pairs: Any four pair of your choice. The lesser, the better. Only one pair would be the BEST.

    Time Frame: 30 mins/ 1H. The higher TF, the better.

    The above two parameters should never change for the entire 4 month's duration.

    Read
    #2) above again and let me know.

    Last edited by sheetal; 05-09-2010 at 09:12 AM. Reason: added Tf & pairs

  3. The Following User Says Thank You to sheetal For This Useful Post:


  4. #3
    Gold Member Array barbara's Avatar
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    I just like to say good job Sheetal

    Barbara

  5. #4
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    This is a long post most of the members here may wish to skip it.. I hope a few of long term successful traders will read it and give me some feedback..
    Thanks
    Steve

    Hi Sheetal,

    Nice thought out response thank you . However I have been there. It's not as easy as you say here, it is much more difficult than you would think it to be. I have traded manually and my longest run in being in the green was just over 8 months. Now that is a lot, I am not bragging but few can really say this. I trade full time so I am always in the market and my exposure to market is more than most.

    What I came here to learn or find out is how someone can make a good living off of trading year after year. I use to think it was following the rules exactly and I thought exactly as you that the real holy grail is between the 2 ears. So I did practice my demos for 3 months before I traded mini lots.

    Discipline is not the problem nor has been the problem for me. I have spent near half my life in martial arts and it's as easy for me to follow rules exactly as it is to get out of bed in the morning and put on my shoes.

    However and this is why I am here I have found it impossible to stay in profit all the time from week to week making a nice income. I have come to the conclusion(willing to be proved wrong)
    that any trader no matter how good will come to problems that are impossible to work out.
    These problems have nothing to do with trading, news, fundamentals, following the rules exactly,MM,etc. These problems are done to the traders from the brokers. No matter how good a trader you are you will eventually lose because of this. Stop hunting,taking the other side of the trade plus a lot of other things that the broker does that you have no knowledge of that will end the end get you as sure as the same if your using a Martingale EA it may look great and it does when it's working but the time will come when it does not work and then your history. No matter what brokers may tell you or what you may think about brokers take it from me your area between your ears is your worst enemy regarding this. Why? Because you think you can think it through just as I did,you think that because your smart maybe smarter than most you have a good knowledge the way brokers work and what they do as I also thought.. The sad sad truth is you don't.
    No matter what you think you know you don't know it's really that simple. There are things that brokers do every single day to take your money and make no mistake about it in the end they will have their victory.

    Given this I still have the hope thought I feel it's based more in hope than the actual facts as I know them to be. I have the hope that there may be a few people a few traders that for reasons they may not even know have been able to succeed regardless of what the brokers do.
    It's why I am here to learn not about other systems I can trade most systems and make money, once you can really follow rules then it's not hard. My question in my first post was if anyone has a system that is profitable year after year by just following the rules exactly. The problem with this your success as a trader has little to do with yo being able to follow a system exactly and it has everything to do with what I call "broker snipers" who have your number and they are there taking shots at you and you have absolutely no idea this is happening as matter of fact you would probably argue this fact with me or anyone if they told you this is why you cannot win. So even the brokers that are doing this have their enemy on their own side. This is how crazy this Forex trading has become.

    I am not here to to change anyone's thinking we all need to learn from our mistakes, we need to learn from others that have truthful knowledge that we do not have,we need to learn from others that have somehow succeeded in this most difficult game of all called Forex Trading.

    It's my hope that I will find a few traders in here that would be willing to share wit me how they have succeeded. I am not speaking of the normal type recreational trader that most here are. I am speaking about full time traders who trade around 20 days a month full time, who have been doing this for over 2 years and always being in profit month after month. It's from them I came to learn.
    I do believe these people exist and I believe it's possible to have some here in this Forum.

    So I thank you again for your response to me. It's a nice and helping response with some nice teaching lessons in it. But as you can see this will not help me at all because you can trade perfect in this business and still lose and what do we say Oh it's Forex remember! Yes it is Forex but do not fool yourself it's not because its Forex and it's a "act of god" thing and that is why you lost. It's because it's Forex and someone was out to get you in a very organized, high tech way that you had no knowledge of. My theory about this is some traders are able to survive past these kinds of attacks and they are probably doing it unknowingly. So my hope is if I can examine how these traders are being successful for such a long time I may be able to see what it is they are doing that is protecting them from these "sniper brokers" Because believe me they are there just as much as organize crime is in Vegas with the Casinos you have the same happening in the world of Forex brokers..

    Happy trading to all
    Steve..




    Quote Originally Posted by sheetal View Post
    Hello Steve,

    Welcome to this lovely forum. You would surely receive many important & helpful insights on your query from many of the members here who knows this business inside out. But let me try to address this with my very limited knowledge and understanding. Here we go:

    First of all, your answer is hidden in your question itself.

    #1) Yes, there is. Which one?


    Visit: holy-grail-forex.com and you could buy this for only US$ 97.

    Jokes apart,

    To be serious, yes, it's there. Leave alone hit accuracy of 60%. I'm really comfortable with a hit accuracy of 40 - 50%.

    There are not one but MANY trading systems that consistently brings in profit when followed exactly by the rules.

    The problem is with the last part of the sentence - "...
    when followed exactly by the rules."

    Remember, we're human beings and not machines which perform repeatedly the exact same protocols 1000 times over & over again - precisely in accordance with the pre-defined set of Rules. We violate the 'exact rules' on drop of a hat that we're supposed to follow & then we blame it on the trading system, broker, big dogs, cyborgs, moons, stars and what not.

    Only the ONE single individual among a million who has the discipline to follow the exact set of instructions in strict accordance repeatedly and the understanding that two consecutive events are entirely independent are the one who closes the first year and the next 50 - 70 years of his/her life in Green.

    Trading and the market is located between the trader's two ears - it's all mental aspect.

    #2) Same as #1) above.

    Do you have it what it takes to follow a trading system with very few and very very simple set of rules?

    Leave alone millionaire - there is no upper limit to the income generated. But read #1) and the line above.


    #3) Are you sure? Think again my dear friend.

    Just because some fishes lives in ponds near my house, am I correct to assume that all fishes in this world lives in ponds?


    #4) Ummm, it's Worse. Least in gambling houses they provide you with couple of drinks and many hot chicks around. But here, brokers offer nothing but a cold phone call.

    It's gambling when you don't know what you're doing. And this attitude is what it makes it frustrating.





    ** A simple proposal 4 you:

    You might want to take this up for assessing yourself and this activity is not for others. This activity would potentially answer your question:

    "My own experience has shown no such system exists or I have not come across it."


    Search in Google using these keywords:

    Trendline Break+jhig

    What is the first result?


    Could you take up demo trades based on this system for next 4 months, execute the trades as you would have done on a real money account plus post your trades on this very thread regularly for the entire period?

    Suggeted pairs: Any four pair of your choice. The lesser, the better. Only one pair would be the BEST.

    Time Frame: 30 mins/ 1H. The higher TF, the better.

    The above two parameters should never change for the entire 4 month's duration.

    Read
    #2) above again and let me know.


  6. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve_xxtrader View Post
    This is a long post most of the members here may wish to skip it.. I hope a few of long term successful traders will read it and give me some feedback..
    Thanks
    Steve

    Hi Sheetal,

    Nice thought out response thank you . However I have been there. It's not as easy as you say here, it is much more difficult than you would think it to be. I have traded manually and my longest run in being in the green was just over 8 months. Now that is a lot, I am not bragging but few can really say this. I trade full time so I am always in the market and my exposure to market is more than most.

    What I came here to learn or find out is how someone can make a good living off of trading year after year. I use to think it was following the rules exactly and I thought exactly as you that the real holy grail is between the 2 ears. So I did practice my demos for 3 months before I traded mini lots.

    Discipline is not the problem nor has been the problem for me. I have spent near half my life in martial arts and it's as easy for me to follow rules exactly as it is to get out of bed in the morning and put on my shoes.

    However and this is why I am here I have found it impossible to stay in profit all the time from week to week making a nice income. I have come to the conclusion(willing to be proved wrong)
    that any trader no matter how good will come to problems that are impossible to work out.
    These problems have nothing to do with trading, news, fundamentals, following the rules exactly,MM,etc. These problems are done to the traders from the brokers. No matter how good a trader you are you will eventually lose because of this. Stop hunting,taking the other side of the trade plus a lot of other things that the broker does that you have no knowledge of that will end the end get you as sure as the same if your using a Martingale EA it may look great and it does when it's working but the time will come when it does not work and then your history. No matter what brokers may tell you or what you may think about brokers take it from me your area between your ears is your worst enemy regarding this. Why? Because you think you can think it through just as I did,you think that because your smart maybe smarter than most you have a good knowledge the way brokers work and what they do as I also thought.. The sad sad truth is you don't.
    No matter what you think you know you don't know it's really that simple. There are things that brokers do every single day to take your money and make no mistake about it in the end they will have their victory.

    Given this I still have the hope thought I feel it's based more in hope than the actual facts as I know them to be. I have the hope that there may be a few people a few traders that for reasons they may not even know have been able to succeed regardless of what the brokers do.
    It's why I am here to learn not about other systems I can trade most systems and make money, once you can really follow rules then it's not hard. My question in my first post was if anyone has a system that is profitable year after year by just following the rules exactly. The problem with this your success as a trader has little to do with yo being able to follow a system exactly and it has everything to do with what I call "broker snipers" who have your number and they are there taking shots at you and you have absolutely no idea this is happening as matter of fact you would probably argue this fact with me or anyone if they told you this is why you cannot win. So even the brokers that are doing this have their enemy on their own side. This is how crazy this Forex trading has become.

    I am not here to to change anyone's thinking we all need to learn from our mistakes, we need to learn from others that have truthful knowledge that we do not have,we need to learn from others that have somehow succeeded in this most difficult game of all called Forex Trading.

    It's my hope that I will find a few traders in here that would be willing to share wit me how they have succeeded. I am not speaking of the normal type recreational trader that most here are. I am speaking about full time traders who trade around 20 days a month full time, who have been doing this for over 2 years and always being in profit month after month. It's from them I came to learn.
    I do believe these people exist and I believe it's possible to have some here in this Forum.

    So I thank you again for your response to me. It's a nice and helping response with some nice teaching lessons in it. But as you can see this will not help me at all because you can trade perfect in this business and still lose and what do we say Oh it's Forex remember! Yes it is Forex but do not fool yourself it's not because its Forex and it's a "act of god" thing and that is why you lost. It's because it's Forex and someone was out to get you in a very organized, high tech way that you had no knowledge of. My theory about this is some traders are able to survive past these kinds of attacks and they are probably doing it unknowingly. So my hope is if I can examine how these traders are being successful for such a long time I may be able to see what it is they are doing that is protecting them from these "sniper brokers" Because believe me they are there just as much as organize crime is in Vegas with the Casinos you have the same happening in the world of Forex brokers..

    Happy trading to all
    Steve..
    Hi Steve,

    Thank you very much for a comprehensive response.

    After reading thru your explanation, I understand that I misunderstood your concern.

    Well, I highly appreciate your experience and knowledge and I respect you for that.

    Trading systems do fail and all trading system has something draw-down period. Nothing new in that.

    To be open, your concern is out of my range and I'd request more knowledgeable & experienced individuals in this forum to help you out with this and this knowledge would be beneficial for us all. I really don't know how to beat the brokers at their own game.

    However, if you enter the following keywords in Google, you might get a good article:

    Technical Analysis Fallacy+fti

    Open the first result. I don't know if you've already gone thru it. But if you've, do let us know about the information there in more simplistic format.

    Thank you,
    Last edited by sheetal; 05-09-2010 at 04:12 PM. Reason: keywords

  7. #6
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    Hi Sheetal,

    Thank you sir spoken as a true gentleman you are. I will for sure take a look at the keyword(s) you gave.
    I might just be chasing the wind on this one. I hate to say it but when you know the game is fixed no matter what you do that kills you from paying.(most sensible people anyway)
    We all know that Gambling is fixed but we still gamble right. We know that if there were a few more black squares or more red squares on the Roulette wheel then the better would have better odds than the house. It's fixed the other way for the house yet it's hard to even get a spot at a Roulette wheel at times. I feel it's the same as with Forex trading.
    If your smart you can follow the rules, if your smart you can do your job of making sure you done your part 100% but at the end you have to hope like the person at the Roulette wheel that this will be your lucking day where a broker will not take me out..

    There is only one book I am aware of that begins to tell this story I think it's called." Beat the Forex dealer"
    I have read it but even this book is just touching service level with brokers.

    The only way so far that I have found where you can beat the brokers at their own game is by position trading(long trades 100 pips or more)
    For example I made a few hundred pips last week because I shorted the eur/usd the broker really cannot do anything about that .
    But on short and medium trades they can and will. I myself am not a great position trader..

    Happy trading
    Thanks again for a solid and honest response.
    Steve

  8. #7
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    Hi Sheetal,

    Thank you sir spoken as a true gentleman you are. I will for sure take a look at the keyword(s) you gave.
    I might just be chasing the wind on this one. I hate to say it but when you know the game is fixed no matter what you do that kills you from paying.(most sensible people anyway)
    We all know that Gambling is fixed but we still gamble right. We know that if there were a few more black squares or more red squares on the Roulette wheel then the better would have better odds than the house. It's fixed the other way for the house yet it's hard to even get a spot at a Roulette wheel at times. I feel it's the same as with Forex trading.
    If your smart you can follow the rules, if your smart you can do your job of making sure you done your part 100% but at the end you have to hope like the person at the Roulette wheel that this will be your lucking day where a broker will not take me out..

    There is only one book I am aware of that begins to tell this story I think it's called." Beat the Forex dealer"
    I have read it but even this book is just touching service level with brokers.

    The only way so far that I have found where you can beat the brokers at their own game is by position trading(long trades 100 pips or more)
    For example I made a few hundred pips last week because I shorted the eur/usd the broker really cannot do anything about that .
    But on short and medium trades they can and will. I myself am not a great position trader..

    Happy trading
    Thanks again for a solid and honest response.
    Steve

  9. #8
    Gold Member Array barbara's Avatar
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    Sorry guys for interruption..
    I'm just curious, what did they do in your case Steve, the brokers, how did you lose your money beause of them? Was it with EA?

    Barbara

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    Hi Barbara,

    It's not that simple I wish it was. Brokers use methods such as stop hunting and use it a lot more than most people are led to believe.
    Stop hunting is removing your stop by a artificial price spike made by the broker. The broker sees all the stops and most times does trade against you when he sees a large gathering of stops he just sends in a spike to take them out. This is done all the time but it's not just stop hunting there are other devices they use that I will not go into on a public form but I assure you they do exist. I can tell you the general nature of these very high tech devices. They have the ability in a short time frame to see what your trading method is and then they will make the market move just enough to get you out. Now of course it's impossible to see this because it looks like any other market move but it's not.

    To be honest people that say these things about brokers are looked at the same way as people that say they seen a ufo or bigfoot. They had tons of evidence but nothing very concrete. The brokers love this because they can say we are all nuts with this grand conspiracy idea and guess what most people believe it.
    I know better but I still trade because now I know more or less what to look for but still I can gain a lot from other traders that have been doing this very thing and beating the broker for a long time.

    The bottom line is this brokers seldom or never do anything that will pop up a red flag to you because they know they can get discovered. So instead what they do is like a person who has a high tech device linked to thousands of bank accounts taking only penny's per day.
    Happy trading
    steve

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    Gold Member Array barbara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve_xxtrader View Post
    Hi Barbara,

    It's not that simple I wish it was. Brokers use methods such as stop hunting and use it a lot more than most people are led to believe.
    Stop hunting is removing your stop by a artificial price spike made by the broker. The broker sees all the stops and most times does trade against you when he sees a large gathering of stops he just sends in a spike to take them out. This is done all the time but it's not just stop hunting there are other devices they use that I will not go into on a public form but I assure you they do exist. I can tell you the general nature of these very high tech devices. They have the ability in a short time frame to see what your trading method is and then they will make the market move just enough to get you out. Now of course it's impossible to see this because it looks like any other market move but it's not.

    To be honest people that say these things about brokers are looked at the same way as people that say they seen a ufo or bigfoot. They had tons of evidence but nothing very concrete. The brokers love this because they can say we are all nuts with this grand conspiracy idea and guess what most people believe it.
    I know better but I still trade because now I know more or less what to look for but still I can gain a lot from other traders that have been doing this very thing and beating the broker for a long time.

    The bottom line is this brokers seldom or never do anything that will pop up a red flag to you because they know they can get discovered. So instead what they do is like a person who has a high tech device linked to thousands of bank accounts taking only penny's per day.
    Happy trading
    steve
    Thank you Steve hope we will find the way to kick their ass so that they stop doing that to us
    Happy trading to you to Steve
    Barbara

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